VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

JCDunn · Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 8:05 am Post subject: Tact Education

A client sent me a link to a project I provided voice for and asked me to take a listen. The music bed he used was way too loud, almost to the point of drowning out my voice over. The client is totally proud of the final production but I need to tell him that he might want to pull the music back. How do I do this without bursting his bubble? I would like to work with him in the future.
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Michael Schoen · Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:23 am Post subject:

Did he ask for your opinion?
If he did that opens the door for you to say the music is a bit hot he might scale it back a little.
I have had too similar experiences.
In one case, I told the client the music was too hot and she shot back -- no it isn't.
Fortunately, she still loves me.
In another case I did a dry narration the client liked -- but then when the commissioned music was available, I had to do a whole new narration to match the music.
But if he was just letting you hear the final product and not asking for your opinion you might want to let it go.
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mcm · Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:06 am Post subject:

I always just let it go unless they have asked my opinion.

I recently got a link to a finished piece. My client wrote "our client loves it and I think you will too". I watched the video and listened to the narration and it was clear they had used Take 1, done in a phone patch session. I had promised them an additional take offline, and they asked me to re-do a line because the lack of punctuation in the script changed the meaning of the sentence. So I did two more takes after we hung up, correcting that sentence in the process.

They used the original with the incorrect line. I was tempted to point it out but they sounded so happy, I just felt like I'd be bursting their bubble if I said anything. And if they figure it out on their own, they have the other takes and can fix it.

jsgilbert · Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:25 am Post subject:

This is always a tricky situation. One would like to think that anything they say that may contribute to the overall betterment of the project would be okay.

However, it most definitely has a lot to do with who the folks are that are pulling your strings.

I can't even say that one could make a distinction that a non-union production may be a more open forum for exchange of thought than a union production or that a national SAG spot is a place you have to keep your mouth shut. In general, (the more people present from the clients side) X (the amount of money you're being paid) = how much you simply say what you are asked to say and when to say it.

I think that the longer you do this, the more you tend to develop a sense and a way of figuring out the best way to either say or not say something. A big problem with reading a room, comes from today's new ways of hiring and working with talent. One of my better repeat clients these days is a lawyer. Scripts are sent. I read them and send back files. His assistant might ask for some changes, additions, corrections and that's that. I've actually only talked with him once, about a year and a half ago and to his assistant a couple of times.

A while back, I thought there was some sort of legal agreement on a script that was incorrect and I asked i an email if it was out of place for me to mention when I saw something that might be a grammatical or logical error and point it out, given that this is legalese, etc.

Not only did I get an emphatic "YES", but when I responded, I got sent back a 2 page e-mail explaining why the passage was correct.

Other things creep into sessions and even on occasion, whether I was directed or not, I changed some grammar around on a different take. When we would all go to local studios, I would often talk to the engineer when there was a smoke break, etc.

Specifically, in this case, my guess is you are not very close to the client or otherwise you probably wouldn't have made this post. You could send them an email and ask if they indeed did direct you to the final mix for the project. Or if you are speaking to them on the phone, you might mention that you've been interested in getting more opinions on production and ask them how they determine how many db's loud everything should be and the relationship of the music to the sound effects. Based on their answer, you may see some wiggle room to make your opinion known.

The conundrum is this: If they mix something poorly and their client chooses not to hire them again, then you won't get hired again.
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Mike Harrison · Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:30 am Post subject:

Hoo, boy. This is a plague. Most probably it's video editors doing the audio mix, and they're probably listening at near-ear-splitting levels. When loud, almost anything sounds right. I'm hearing this in produced segments for TV news magazine shows, too. And not just music; B-roll audio, such as dialogue and natural sound, too. The concept of background sound being in the background is not being grasped. Whatever the message, it's lost if the listener can't understand it.
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ConnieTerwilliger · Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:06 pm Post subject:

Ah - the under 40 mix - compared to the over 40 mix.
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Bruce · Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 5:29 am Post subject:

I'm thinking the best policy is "just set it, and forget it". What they do with our work is usually, totally out of our hands (just ask a novelist who's book gets turned into a movie). When I get final product I give great thanks, and I keep the best and quietly toss the rest. Even when asked, giving an opinion to the folks who write the checks can be walking on egg shell time.

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Mike Harrison · Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 5:46 am Post subject:

Melanie Haynes · Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 3:15 pm Post subject:

I agree with Bruce and Mike on this. Probably best to just say "thanks"! We need to know when to keep our mouths shut, too......not always easy for me Embarrassed

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samowry · Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:01 pm Post subject:

My 2¢ usually rests on if they tell you "Here is the final cut" or "Here is a rough cut". Rough, throw your 2¢ in, final, do what Bruce does.

That usually works anyway.

Mike Harrison · Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:08 pm Post subject:

whalewtchr · Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:06 pm Post subject:

We're all sub-contractors in the grand scheme of things. I did a fabulous job installing the electrical and got paid---I had nothing to do with the fact they painted the house purple and black and it is horrible to look at.

Once my part is done and they approve, I move on.
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todd ellis · Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 7:49 pm Post subject:

yup - what jonah said.
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Bruce · Posted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 4:31 am Post subject:

jsgilbert · Posted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:28 am Post subject:

Well, I hate to tell you that when we had the exterior of the house painted, one of the painters, in broken English explained a potential problem with our windows that had een installed a few months earlier. It saved us what could have been a considerable future repair bill.

Interestingly, hundreds of thousands of people who have no point of reference, experience or knowledge have no problem dispensing advice and information (or misinformation) every day via the internet.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, there's nothing wrong with "asking" someone why they elected to do something a certain way, when done properly.

It can often be a tight rope act, but I don't think I would advise anyone in adopting a "don't ask, don't tell" policy
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