VO-BB - A VO Family Forum Index VO-BB - A VO Family
15 Years and Counting!
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Connect to other studios from within Pro Tools!
Goto page Previous  1, 2
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    VO-BB - A VO Family Forum Index -> Gear !
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
kgenus
Seriously Devoted


Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 889
Location: Greater NYC Area

PostPosted: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just got the email, Preview Release is available.
_________________
Genus
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Charlie Channel
Club 300


Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 356
Location: East Palo Alto, CA

PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2005 3:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Source Connect costs $1,495 -- about the same as an AudioTX Communicator. Oh, and Source Connect supports full duplex.



I think I'm beginning to understand one question I had with the AudioTX Communicator integrating with Digidesign hardware. ASIO-2 is an interface standard that Digidesign hardware, supposedly, complies with. That permits other software applications to play with its hardware. Technically, AudioTX Communicator should seamlessly integrate with the MBox or 002-Rack. In othter words, you should not have to purchase or use another sound card, either in the same DAW or a separate computer, to use AudioTX.



Think of it like this: If you buy AudioTX Communicator, and you have, say Sound Blaster, it will work with that card. And if you have Internet, you can then use the IP option to work with another Communicator. Well, the M-Box is nothing more than a sound card, as is the 002-Rack.



I was able to use other application software with my 002-Rack using the ASIO-2 driver (software other than Pro Tools, i.e., Cubase). But, not the AudioTX, although AudioTX works with other ASIO-2 compliant hardware.



Digidesign said the Communicator was not "Qualified." That seemed strange, to me. And, I speculated they'd modified the standard in some way to insure a lack of connectivity to their hardware.



After reading the literature for the Souce Connect application, my guess is that's exactly what Digidesign's done -- insured that only "qualified" software applications connect to their hardware. Sounce Connect's been under development for 2 years. It works only with Pro Tools. It's qualified.



That's biz, I guess. But, for the buck, it seems to me AudioTX offers more utility and flexibility. For VO via Internet, latency may still be an issue with Source Connect. We'll find out after a test is run. I don't know how you'd get around that issue. Also, if a producer assembles an ensemble (which does happen), a studio using a codec with multiple ISDN circuits on the studio end will premit talent to be used from various remote locations. I don't see Internet replacing ISDN for that kind of real-time interactivity.



Just my $0.02.



CC
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Charlie Channel
Club 300


Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 356
Location: East Palo Alto, CA

PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2005 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK. My rig is hot and ready to test the tool.



Just a couple of observations, here.



1. The fatal flaw is the Internet. I say that because it took me more time than I'd care to spend getting stuff working. I don't think it's the problem with the plug-in. Rather, Comcast's servers and XP's TCPIP stack and Lynksys's router and hub present challenges for we running LAN's. Basically, I've taken the router out of the equasion. That eliminates a firewall. I'm sure I could keep the firewall up through the router, but I'd have to make sure the correct ports are enabled. I just kind of lost patience playing the technie role. And, I'm sure some users will NOT want to expose their DAW to Internet.



2. Digidesign recommend running Pro Tools without Internet connectivity being active. I happen to disobey their suggestion without any negative consequences; however, I know other users have issues keeping PT running without crashing. I think that depends on the CPU chipset.



3. Getting through the Dongle thing wasn't too hard. But, doing it the first time is an interesting experience.



So, my evaluation copy is on my machine and ready for testing. If you'd like to conneect with me, cchannel's my userid on the server. Send me E-mail when you're ready to play.



CC
_________________
Charlie
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Charlie Channel
Club 300


Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 356
Location: East Palo Alto, CA

PostPosted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 9:36 pm    Post subject: First Look at Source-Connect Reply with quote

Hello,



I was hoping to try out Source-Connect with anyone who signed up to use the plug-in, but I managed to get a session in with Source-Elements.



First impression: Latency via IP is lower than with AudioTX Communicator's IP feature. We did a loop-back test to measure latency. Latency was reduced to 280 m/sec's, using the smallest buffer size. That's as good as any codec on the market. Full duplex communication is enabled. Not too shabby for IP communications.



Set-up is simplified IF you download the Source-Connect Preview pts file. Do that. Otherwise, you'll have to set up a session and get everything pointed in the right direction. Save time, use the preview pts session to get started.



Quality of transmission to the recording studio is excellent. My Shure SM-58, mic'd from 4 inches out, sounded great on the playback to my system (I worked Source-Connect from my control room, rather than the booth), because I was playing with the configuration, etc.



My upload speed with ComCast is 284 mb, right at the margin (300 is recommended). We found that a lower sample rate "96" worked fine, with minimal buffering and error correction set to zero (normally runs at value 1 or more). Talent would definitely want to obtain a higher throuhput rate, to have the extra margin of reserve, from an ISP (i.e, 300 mb or better on the upload).



ComCast is cable and my ISP. The problem with high speed Internet through cable is that as more users come on-line, speed can deteriorate. That happened to me; however, a disconnect/reconnect with the plug-in restored the quality, so that there were no drop-outs.



Although the application is priced at almost $1,500, it will pay for itself over time. My ISDN circuit costs about $450/year - excluding long distance connect charges. I mentioned that some voice talent may prefer a different way of paying for the use of the plug-in, like paying for the use of it as needed (renting it).



The plug-in integrates connectivity to the Souce-Element's website, where you -- the user -- have an account. It's really slick. Your browser automatically launches when and takes you to their server where you can see all the other studios and users who have registered and who are running Source-Connect. And, you can easily add them to your contact list that is displayed within the plug-in. It's really slick.



The objective is to build a community using the plug-in, where talent is selected, too. They're envisioning allowing users to upload their demo's on the site. My guess is that the plug-in's here to stay and that it will supplant some ISDN useage at time goes on.



How it works: First, you login with you userid and passwd. Then, you test your connection (note: if you go through a router or firewall, you'll have to set things up so that you can communicate through the firewall/router).



When someone wants to connect with you, and if you're in Pro-Tools with the plug-in enabled on an insert, you'll get a pop-up dialong box that informs you that a user wants a session. You select "yes" and you're off to the races.



If you haven't downloaded the plug-in, enabled it and tested, give it a test drive. It works, as advertised.



CC
_________________
Charlie


Last edited by Charlie Channel on Sun Mar 06, 2005 6:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
ConnieTerwilliger
Triple G


Joined: 07 Dec 2004
Posts: 3231
Location: San Diego - serving the world

PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 11:21 am    Post subject: Studio Working Preferences Reply with quote

Order of Preference:



ISDN: I get direction - no recording responsibilities - I can concentrate on my performance and having fun. Just go into my closet and shut the door.



In someone else's studio: Live, face-to-face interaction with another human being - what a concept! Again - I can be directed with no recording responsbilities and I can concentrate on my performance and having fun.



My studio - self-directed: I can do this on my own time - as many takes as I want until I'm happy - the engineering becomes background at this point because no one is hanging on every word. But this works best for those jobs where direction would be superfluous...the stuff you do in your unconsiously competent state.



My studio - Phone Patch: as you can see - last on my list. While I truly enjoy being directed, I don't like to be directed when I also have to be keeping an eye on the technical side - although there isn't a lot to do on the technical side these days once you have your system set for your voice and the record function going.



Regards,

Connie
_________________
Playing for a living...
www.voiceover-talent.com
YouTube Channel: http://youtube.com/connieterwilliger
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Charlie Channel
Club 300


Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 356
Location: East Palo Alto, CA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 7:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My favorite gig was working in an ensemble of talents for an animated feature cartoon. Nothing like being in a great studio with a bunch of good actors, engineers, writers, a director and cartoonists.



I think the point is that the landscape for vo work is changing. For newbies, like me, entry into this biz that's grounded in marketing and sales fundamentals, technological innovation and swelling ranks of qualified talent presents challenges. How to minimize barriers to entry becomes a key question we face.



What to do? One potential client said, "We'll add you to our stable of talent, if you have ISDN." So, I've got it. For sure, I get a lot of auditions from them. But, I've yet to use ISDN for a gig. MP3's. Speakerphone. It's nice to know I'll have ISDN when I get the call. Meanwhile, it's an expense on the accounting books.



Can you imagine not having Internet and high speed connectivity at this juncture in history, and being in the business? I'd bet there are some (a small number) who don't have Internet and who still make a living at this. But, that really doesn't seem to be the way things are for most VO talent.



The Source-Connect product is yet another way studios are attempting to be more competitive, by driving down the cost of production while maintaining quality. It should be interesting to see how this product fares in the marketplace.



When I spoke to the marketing-enginner, I said that I had a real concern about the entry cost given the other investments that must be made. They'll need to work out a way to make the product painless to acquire to talent who may take advantage of it.



CC
_________________
Charlie
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
SoundsGreat-Elaine Singer
King's Row


Joined: 30 Dec 2004
Posts: 1043
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 7:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My understanding is that this solution works only with Pro Tools. Isn't Pro Tools itself much more expensive than the other software packages out there? I know there is a free Pro Tools out there but apparently it only works with Windows 98. I guess what I'm asking is, is it worth getting Pro Tools just for this new tool? By the way, I currently use Cool Edit Pro 2.
_________________
Elaine
The Youthful Mature Voice
Elaine Singer Voiceovers
Twitter
Senectitude is not for the faint of heart.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Deirdre
Czarina Emeritus


Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 12860
Location: East Jesus, Maine

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pro Tools seems to be industry standard. I have uploaded entire sessions to remote production facilities via FTP.



Pro Tools: the Ligua Franca of the recording world.
_________________
DBCooperVO.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Charlie Channel
Club 300


Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 356
Location: East Palo Alto, CA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Source-Connect application was actually conceived and, ultimately, produced by professional recording engineers. They just put one-and-one together, after doing many, many projects and decided going direct to Pro Tools is a better way, given that Digidesign sells inexpensive hardware that enables remote and small home-studio projects to be easily done.



The question they asked, was, Why are we going ISDN through codecs when we've got Pro Tools on each end? If we had Internet as a connector between Pro Tools, we'd be able to directly record into our session.



It's probably easier said than done, but it's been done. Now, they've launched the product and are out to make some sales and make some money.



CC
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
kgenus
Seriously Devoted


Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 889
Location: Greater NYC Area

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 3:38 pm    Post subject: It's Long Reply with quote

SoundsGreat-Elaine Singer wrote:
My understanding is that this solution works only with Pro Tools. Isn't Pro Tools itself much more expensive than the other software packages out there?




All things equal, there are other solutions, but I believe ProTools is the most inexpensive way to get started in audio these days. At $500, the MBox gets you right into "the" industry standard all in one package. Sure, you can buy other products, but you may still need to purchase hardware for AD conversion. When Cool Edit Pro was out, its price point was extremely competitive at a mere $99, amazing price and editor. However, that has all changed now. Adobe Audition is $289, throw in the converter and you're back up to $500, so you can see what I'm talking about.



If you've already made the investment in hardware, it is very easy to understand or question the additional cost. Unfortunately, the trend has been to provide development for ProTools based platforms first because the install base is so large. It's the only real return on the investment. Steinberg has made a strong showing recently, but I know numerous engineers who have ended up selling off those systems for ProTools based platforms.



I like this plugin but I think it's a steep price to pay. I almost feel punished for thinking about it when I see the price. $2000 for one plugin and an MBox -or- a new ISDN codec which is much more expensive. It's a tough choice.



ISDN has a large install base and that landscape will change. How will ProTools be effected? As long as people like Frank are coming up with other solutions, it's definitely going to be a waiting game. At least for me, and more importantly, my wallet.



Kevin
_________________
Genus
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Charlie Channel
Club 300


Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 356
Location: East Palo Alto, CA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 4:12 pm    Post subject: Re: It's Long Reply with quote

kgenus wrote:


ISDN has a large install base and that landscape will change. How will ProTools be effected? As long as people like Frank are coming up with other solutions, it's definitely going to be a waiting game. At least for me, and more importantly, my wallet.



Kevin




I think the folks who produced the plug-in need to really examine their marketing model. As an example, they should consider charging the producing studio a fixed price for the plug-in and the remote talent studio (at least for voice over) some nominal fee for renting the plug-in for the session.



If they did that, then any production studio running Pro Tools, if they purchased the plug-in, would be able to ask talent if they have Pro Tools. If so, the session could be set up and the remote studio's Dongle licensed for the session for, say $5. Or better, yet charge the originating studio $3,000 for the plug and $100 for remotes. The idea is simply to leverage off the installed base.



The point is, I think they need to think about a different biz model.



I was told Source-Elements is thinking about charging a small fee per use, with a 'rent-to-own' business model. The idea is to charge a fixed fee per session and after a requisite number of rentals, the user owns the plug-in.



I, too, will wait before making an additional investment in connectivity products. I've got enough connectivity. What I need is more work. Smile



CC
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    VO-BB - A VO Family Forum Index -> Gear ! All times are GMT - 7 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group