VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

[Rob Ellis]

Lately I find that I have been going to the 103 for most of my voice stuff,
and have had to reluctantly admit that the 103 is better for my voice.

It's hard to admit that maybe I don't have quite the right voice for a Senn, but I am beginning to believe that may be the case.

It looks like I will be selling it on E-Bay shortly. If there are interested takers here, I will sell it for around $750.

If any 416ers have any thought or suggestions on how to get the most out of the famed shotgun, let me know, because part of me is a little reluctant to part with it. But when it's just collecting dust, well....

[Lance Blair]

I'd say keep the 416. You will use it over the long haul, and you might like it with a different preamp that you might possibly acquire down the road. I sold my 416 because I didn't like it, but I still have a Sanken CS-1 that I really like but I still miss the 416 and wish I had it in my studio.

What is it that you don't like about the 416?

I was a 103 naysayer for a long time, and now I'm using it.
_________________
Skype: globalvoiceover
and now, http://lanceblairvo.com the blog is there now too!

[Rob Ellis]

It's not that I don't like it, just that I seem to give a better performance in front of a TLM 103...it seems to pick up my full vocal range easier.

I address the Senn about 6" away, with it positioned about 45 degrees down(aiming toward the chest) but I don't stand directly in front of it, I stand about 30 degrees to the side

[bobsouer]

Rob,

What happens to the sound when you do stand directly in front of it? (Assuming all the other angles remain the same.)
_________________
Be well,
Bob Souer (just think of lemons)
The second nicest guy in voiceover.
+1-724-613-2749
Source Connect, phone patch, pony express

[Jowillie]

....and close....REAL close... just off your lips. It is a different type of intrument for voiceover. It requires a much different technique. You need to exercise a great deal of lip, mouth, tongue and teeth control to get the most dynamic sound from the 416.
It sounds the same or "less" than other mics if worked at "normal" distances.
It will have a highly compressed, "in-your-face" sound. Not everyone is comfortable with that style....and every circumstance doesn't require an "in-your-face" style.
You should have no trouble getting your investment back out of the 416. Let us know if you are selling it for sure.
_________________
Wild Willie Edwards
www.hometowntvtoday.com
http://vomictest.blogspot.com

[SomeAudioGuy]

I know what you mean.
My mic collection just keeps growing, and sometimes I wonder why I keep things around.

I would hold on to the 416. It really is just plain worth more than what you'll get for it (unless you really need the cash). My 416 is far from my primary go-to mic, but it's a valuable tool in my arsenal.

One thing I've found about the 416 though, is off axis rejection is REALLY tight. Standing 30 degrees off is probably killing your sound.The design of this mic is head on, front and center.
_________________
Hey! Whaddaya hear?
http://someaudioguy.blogspot.com

[Rob Ellis]

Wow, and here I had somehow picked up the notion that you were supposed to address it from the side and at a distance....?

As a reflection of how much I respect everyone's opinion here, I have cancelled the e-bay listing and will give the 416 another try for awhile.

Thanks for the suggestions about how to address it.(and how not to!)

It's running through an Avalon 737 if that makes a difference.

What's interesting it that I've talked with 3 different people(via this message board and thru e-mail), all of whom said they too sold their 416s but later wished they still had them.

Thanks again!

[Lance Blair]

I've been using a PR40 in many cases where I would have used a 416. I just went back and A/B-ed files I have of each and I really prefer high end dynamics (SM7b, Heil, RE20/27, Beyer) to the 416 in many cases where a 416 might be used (but not always).

Still, keep the 416!

I prefer the MKH60 and Sanken CS1 and Schoeps to the 416...and I've used the MKH 50 short shotgun recording political and commercial spots...that mic is excellent for vo!
_________________
Skype: globalvoiceover
and now, http://lanceblairvo.com the blog is there now too!

[Rob Ellis]

Okay,

I have tried close miking the 416....really close, and WOW what a difference!

How many of you use a pop screen? I'm finding it very necessary, otherwise the closeness and mic sensitivity result in excessive popping and sibilance.

But I can't emphasize how much changing the way I address the mic has made the difference!

Thanks again for preventing me from making a hasty decision!

[Lizden]

Didn't Joe Cip mention on one of his VO Universe vids that he uses a double Pop filter? I think it's #8 or #9...

L.
_________________
Liz de Nesnera O.A.V. ~ Livin' The VO Dream!
English/French Bilingual VO w/ ISDN
HireLiz.com / liz@hireliz.com

[Jeff McNeal]

I know I'm a little late to this thread, but Rob, whatever you do, don't feel sheepish for preferring the 103 to the 416 with your voice, unless you've really had some sort of epiphany about the 416 thanks to this thread. The TLM-103 is so ubiquitous and the 416 is so revered, that sometimes the lines of reason get blurred.

I own both mics and for the time being, it's the 416 that's collecting dust. I won't sell it, but for now, I have other favorites and the 416 is part of my third audio chain. The backup to the backup.

I was surprised, no stunned, to find that the TLM-103 sounds much better on the Avalon 737 I recently picked up as a backup pre than the 416 did, at least for me. Prior to that shock, my TLM was the one that had gone completely unused for about a year while the 416 was getting all the use. But on that pre, I found the 416 sounding too sibilant and shrill, whereas the 103 just sounded more balanced and natural.

It's really amazing what a difference the pre will make in terms of waking up (or revealing the warts) of a microphone.

As for the 103, I preferred it over a M147, which also surprised the heck out of me. I hasten to add that sold the M147 with no regrets whatsoever.

Anyway, it's all good. They're both great mics.

[SomeAudioGuy]

I'm glad we could help.

Over your VO career, the 103 will probably be the more versatile mic in your cabinet, but I think you'll find that the 416 will have its time and place. I prefer it for really tight proximity work, but that's TOTALLY subjective.

A lot of people will put a sock on the 416, but I like a double screen nylon filter instead.
_________________
Hey! Whaddaya hear?
http://someaudioguy.blogspot.com

[Diane Maggipinto]

i had a popper stopper (nylon) with my mic, then removed it for clarity and better sound overall. but i had gremlins, and fought them, making much more work for myself when it came to editing. then, i got a metal pop screen (SE) and lost none of the clarity and all of the editing headaches. i was trying to be a purist; see what obstinance will get me? so ... i'm back on the pop filter bandwagon.
_________________
sitting at #8, though not as present as I'd like to be. Hello!

www.d3voiceworks.com

[Philip Banks]

[bobsouer]

Philip,

I got such a laugh from your "Jazz, fetch" comment, just now. (I'm so very glad that you didn't use my 416 for fetch while I was visiting with you.)
_________________
Be well,
Bob Souer (just think of lemons)
The second nicest guy in voiceover.
+1-724-613-2749
Source Connect, phone patch, pony express