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How much do you edit?
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Dan-O
The Gates of Troy


Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 1603

PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is a "one time through" procedure. Instead of starting and stopping everytime you edit, you can do the edit while the playback is in motion. It is not a perfect edit, but cuts down on time. Looking back at my previous post, you should edit out the dead spaces first. They are kinda easy to spot.

p.s. The Doc comment was not meant to sound sarcastic. I saw it on your site and thought it was pretty cool! Smile
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mcm
Smart Kitteh


Joined: 10 Dec 2004
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Location: w. MA, USA

PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The Doc comment was not meant to sound sarcastic


I know that dear, and I didn't take it that way. But I sure am not feeling very smart right now! I still don't get it, but I'm going to give it a rest and apply myself to it later on.

Thank you for the help, and thanks to all. This board is a PHENOMENAL resource. (yes I am shouting and I don't care who hears me!!!!)
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 10497

PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just out of interest I timed my last project from start to finish. Voice - edit deliver. Was a good exercise as I tend not to clock watch too much.

28 minutes to produce 6mins 4 secs of audio.

If you want to try here is the text. Warm engaging read and you have to get the Italian correct .....................................

The Lombardo winery… like a ripe vine shoot coming from the ancient Sicilian winemaking tradition and grafted to the precision of modern oenological production.

For more than a century the typical Mediterranean wine tradition has met the most advanced techniques at our company. Actually, it is not by chance that the history of Cantine Lombardo is represented by a little vine that thanks to passing time and a strong passion has now become a strong and fertile plant giving a unique fruit: Marsala wine.

Marsala wine has been renowned and appreciated for more than two centuries and it is also the first Italian wine to boast the “D.O.C.” (Designated Origin). “The English Wine”, as it was then called in the 1800’s, is produced in the province of Trapani. This land is ideal for growing grapes because it is close to the sea and, most of all, because of the fertile and rich soils that are continuously exposed to the sun’s rays. Actually the typical production area of Marsala wine lies on the so-called “Fascia del Sole” that is the western part of Sicily.

It was the young English merchant John Woodhouse who started the success of Marsala in 1773 by shipping this precious wine to all the corner of Europe. Just a century later, the production and sale of Marsala was established in the province. In 1881 Giuseppe Lombardo Maltese, a ship owner, realised that the Marsala wine-making business was going to grow enormously and thanks to his intuition, resourcefulness and generosity, typical of the people of Sicily, he planted the seeds of what has today flourished into the Cantine Lombardo.

Our present wineries are located in Marsala, next to Mr Woodhouse’s home: a typical English-style colonial house. They extend over a surface of 20,000 square metres including a covered area of 6,500 square metres. Warehouses have a capacity of 46,000 hectolitres of which 15,000 reside in precious oak casks.
Today the Lombardo winery keeps the secret of Marsala’s legendary history by combining tradition with innovation, love of the past, friendship and family relationships with an entrepreneurial spirit.

At present more than 60% of our production is directed towards foreign markets, mainly to the USA, Europe and many other Asian and Far Eastern countries. Our winery boasts a wide production of flavoured wines (Cremovo, Crema Mandorla, Vino alla Mandorla- Marsala with eggs, almond flavoured Marsala) liqueur-like IGT wines (Malvasia, Zibibbo, Moscato) and Vermouth.

For more than 120 years our passion has combined expertise, fidelity to traditional techniques, innovation and love for nature. This is why we have skilfully cultivated precious grapes such as Grillo, Cataratto and Inzolia, from which we produce a unique Marsala. Only a natural ageing marked by the slow passage of time can guarantee the production of precious, excellent, full-bodied wines, rich in flavour and aromas. Some of our products are:

· Fine Marsala (Marsala Fine )- Amber Dry or Amber Sweet- it is aged for more than a year- intense aroma- it is the ideal for pastries and to be used when cooking meats. Thanks to its versatility it is now one of the key ingredients in the Mediterranean cuisine.
· Marsala Superiore- Dry or Sweet: it is aged for more than two years in oak casks- amber-coloured- intense aroma- a dessert wine which perfectly goes with cakes and petits fours.
· Marsala Vergine Soleras- it is the flower of our production: it is aged for 20 years in oak barrels- antique golden- coloured with a special intense aroma and a dry full-bodied flavour.

The production of the Marsala is regulated by the “legge n.851 del 1984” (law n. 851 of 1984) which defines the designated area of production and bottling, the grapes to be used for its production and strict winemaking rules.
The presence of our products on the international markets for over the last century is the best guarantee of the quality of our wines.
Cantine Lombardo: an entrepreneurial culture nourished by love of tradition, coupled with ambitions for the future has found the key to make a strong wine which embodies the character of the men and women of Sicily, both traditional and innovative.
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mcm
Smart Kitteh


Joined: 10 Dec 2004
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
28 minutes to produce 6mins 4 secs of audio.


So your ratio is 4.66:1! Man, you are a real slow poke! cool
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 10497

PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, I was hurrying!!!! Ratio is wrong as you don't know how long I took to record. 12mins 33secs reading out loud time to be deducted to establish correct editing ratio ................Call a line judge then issue, via your attourney, a full and unreserved retraction!!!
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kgenus
Seriously Devoted


Joined: 01 Dec 2004
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Location: Greater NYC Area

PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Click and sweep is "click and drag" or highlight.

Also, you have to breath from you diaphragm, when you inhale, your stomach should expand ... then your chest. Taking small breaths become very simple when you use this method. If you're still wondering about easier ways, small coffee straws and exhale slowly -or- lots of cardio workouts.

Kevin
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mcm
Smart Kitteh


Joined: 10 Dec 2004
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Location: w. MA, USA

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Ratio is wrong as you don't know how long I took to record.


But the Phil Banks of song and story does all his VO in one take on one breath!

Since you removed half of your recording, tell me what you took out. That's what I really wanted to know in posting this question.

Okay, I'm going to tell all here. In the narration I did for this one company on Tuesday, I removed every breath, every little click, and any "p" that I didn't like the looks of (never mind what it actually sounded like) got a slimming treatment.

Another narration for the same company on Friday - I left the clicks and Ps strictly alone, and just took the breaths out. The actual reading was straightforward and it did not figure significantly in the editing time. [I have since learned that they don't even care about the breaths! Moral: always ask. (as others have noted)]

After finishing that narration, I recorded an audition that was 45 finished seconds, but I probably fussed over the editing of that thing for 10 minutes, trying to get it just so. So, anybody want to weigh in on auditions that you do at home? Do you edit the bejeebers out of those?
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Removed - Pops, clicks and other unwanted noises including conspicuous breaths. Certain things will slip through the net as the audio I supplied was clean; in thoe words no noise gate, compression and flat EQ.The rest of the edits were poor "takes" or where I gave myself an alternate version.

Even with fairly mundane projects there is a difference between "a" read and "the" read.

Where this job differs from others is one has to go from flawless English to flawless Italian mid sentence and beware of English looking words requiring Italian pronunciation e.g Fine, Maltese, Vermouth.

As far as auditions are concerned, 90% of the time I don't do them, 5% I won't do them and the remaining 5% will get a rough read, top and tailed. Most producer request auditions because they can and because We will. "Mud sticks" casting is very poor working practise as it wastes everybody's time. As most of you are based in the USA it's worth saying that EVERY major job I have done in the USA did not come to me as the result of an audition. The opposite is true of jobs for which I recorded specific audition material - I have got none of them, not one, zero! Not bitter or angry about the latter, just very selective about those for whom I audition.
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mcm
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Phil. And if you can indulge me further - for this Italian Job did the client ask you to do the edit or is that the way you usually treat the recordings you do at your own studio?
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 10497

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My package price includes edited audio; it is tidied but not ready to use. Sometimes a client will ask me to edit and make ready for use and others will say that they will edit. In the latter case it's usually for longer projects where paying me to edit is not economical.

Even when the audio is supposed to be unedited I will spend a few minutes doing a tidy up. A great rule of business is "under promise, over deliver".
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donrandall
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since I do not use Cool Edit or Pro Tools or any of the many others, I am wondering if any of these programs have a pop and click filter that is usable and useful for getting rid of some of the little ticks and clicks?

I use Goldwave, and it does have a pop and click filter that can be applied. It will not clean up everything, everytime -- but it does a very good job much of the time.
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


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Posts: 10497

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've never found anything that claimed to do the job that really did the job. If you use something to eliminate these noises in real time they are unable to tell the difference in a click and the k sound in the word click. Net result is getting rid of both wanted and unwanted sounds. In trying to get rid of something already recorded, by the time you played with settings it would be quicker to go back into your booth and do it again.

When working alone we have two main problems. first, the engineer is not there to watch the copy, timing and listen for things that shouldn't be there, so the voice in your head has to be listening as well as saying "Can we have that last line again please". Second, there's no director getting the best performance out of you.
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Gregory Best
The Gates of Troy


Joined: 04 Aug 2005
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Location: San Diego area (east of Connie and south and east of Bailey)

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 8:19 pm    Post subject: Wow Reply with quote

Banksley, what a new look!!! Did you go to Sweden?
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Bailey
4 Large


Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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Location: Lake San Marcos... north of Connie, northwest of the Best.

PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2005 5:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Philip...
I can understand the clean shave, and letting your hair down...
but now you're starting to scare me. Confused
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donrandall
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2005 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I've never found anything that claimed to do the job that really did the job. If you use something to eliminate these noises in real time they are unable to tell the difference in a click and the k sound in the word click. Net result is getting rid of both wanted and unwanted sounds. In trying to get rid of something already recorded, by the time you played with settings it would be quicker to go back into your booth and do it again.


The main reason for my earlier note was to find out if other editing programs include an effective Pop/Click filter - and would it be useful in eliminating or attenuating "mouth music". Does anyone know of any stand alone programs?

The Pop/Click filter in Goldwave is a tool that offers a sensitivity adjustment. After using it just a very few times, it becomes rather intuitive, and takes very little time. Used lightly, there is no apparent sonic damage or audible distortion to the original track. It does not remove everything, but does get a lot of it. I don't mind (too much) cleaning up the gunk between words, where I can see it and get at it - but the extraneous little noises that are right smack dab in the middle of the waveform of a word are pretty darned tough to clean out if doing it manually.
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