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What are the ways clients find us?
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todd ellis
A Zillion


Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 10481
Location: little egypt

PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

it's definitely the difference in the way business is done on the coasts vs. (with a few exceptions) most of the rest of the country. it's just not the same game in flyover country.
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Jack Daniel
Cinquecento


Joined: 23 Jun 2016
Posts: 574
Location: SoCal

PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bob Bergen wrote:
Your post is a gift, my friend.


Thanks Bob. If passing that on can profit someone like your words have profited me, then I'll be in Thrillsville! But I'm not buying a ticket just yet :)

Bruce wrote:
...but there's just so far "that's nice dear" can take you.


Ha! I find that a diet of gruel and glancing praise can sustain me for a week, Bruce!
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Jack Daniel
Narrator / Man About Town
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Bob Bergen
CM


Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Posts: 937

PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, first of all, this is one of a zillion platforms. Most do not have a member’s only section. But nothing is private. Things don’t have to be read firsthand to damage one’s career. Before the internet people committed career suicide by talking too much at the water cooler. The boss didn’t need to be in earshot for the damage to be done.

Need to brag? There’s a way to to accomplish this by way of promoting that will get you your needed pat on the back while you come across far more professional. Now, Jack plays in a very different league than many here. I’m sure if he wants to share career highs he knows like I to phone or email a friend. Just don’t post for the world to see. It’s like the world’s largest e-water cooler.
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Kristin Lennox
Flight Attendant


Joined: 30 Apr 2011
Posts: 858

PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jack Daniel wrote:
And never post about your own work--it's bush league and you will be lumped in with the wannabes.


Well, so why, then, are there auditions asking for your social media stats before you can even audition...? If they don't want you to post about/promote the project (after it's released/aired, of course), why do they care how many followers you have?

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Bob Bergen
CM


Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Posts: 937

PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They absolutely want you to promote...the project, not yourself. And not with any text! No “huge thanks to so-and-so,” etc. Just post a link to the finished product. If there’s any dialogue, allow that to happen organically by your followers and connections. This accomplishes your PR without being blatant or bragging. The more followers you have the more eyes who see the buyer’s product.

But no buyer wants you to utter anything until after it is out there.
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Jack Daniel
Cinquecento


Joined: 23 Jun 2016
Posts: 574
Location: SoCal

PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kristin Lennox wrote:
Well, so why, then, are there auditions asking for your social media stats before you can even audition...?


I've never been asked that or had that as part of my hiring--but then I don't do much in the videogame/animation world, so perhaps that is the difference. For the work I do, they don't want anything to be about us, and often there are restrictions on where things can be posted. I once had a buyer very nicely, but firmly, ask me to take down a Youtube video because the project was licensed exclusively for another set of platforms.

I'd say, if anything, the people I try to emulate in terms of their behavior keep a low profile. Some don't even have their own website.
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Jack Daniel
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todd ellis
A Zillion


Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 10481
Location: little egypt

PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i'm more low-profile than THAT. i don't even have a facebook. or an instatube or a tweetit. so i guess i'm in good shape!
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Bob Bergen
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Joined: 22 Apr 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Other than promo and narration it is rare that my contract does not come with social media promotional requirements. The last national shoe campaign I booked stipulated in the contract I post at least 2 social media mentions a week for every 13 week cycle. Jack is right...and like I said, they aren’t asking me to promote myself. They want me to promote their product. And very often bookings are decided on social media exposure, posts, behavior, and followers.
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 11046
Location: Portgordon, Scotland

PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 1:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see the logic in the above and also see that it is not our job unless we are paid to do the latter. Session fee, use, residuals TVRs et al. In the UK the union Equity is not talking about this. Is it a discussion within SAG-AFTRA?

Off at a slight tangent. Whilst I am not a great lover of Social Media in my life as it has more or less stopped knocks on my door, my phone ringing and the regular Skype chats, I do however understand that it is business. Last week on Twitter I stopped following other voice people other than those I know. Why? Because as anyone who ever attended a "Job Club" run by the local unemployment office in the UK understands, a low grade Civil Servant teaching unemployed people how to get work simply didn't work then and doesn't work now.

Just got myself another coffee and as I walked back into my office I was reminded of something said to me decades ago.

"Successful people have the discipline to do the things other people don't like doing!"

For further growth the above means for my business the real acceptance of what social media could do for my business IF DONE PROPERLY. I know of few, if any in our business who have mastered the last 3 words.
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Bish
3.5 kHz


Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Posts: 3738
Location: Lost in the cultural wasteland of Long Island

PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Philip Banks wrote:
For further growth the above means for my business the real acceptance of what social media could do for my business IF DONE PROPERLY. I know of few, if any in our business who have mastered the last 3 words.

I think this summarizes my own views quite well. There is a surfeit of social media experts and gurus who will tell you they know how to do this... but as far as I can see, the overwhelming majority are just splashing around in the shallow end, spouting buzzwords and trying to create their own little cult following. For the most part, they do not understand the difference between social media engagement and saturation bombing.

I think the best quote I ever heard about social media experts went something like:
"They know as much about social media marketing as my cat does about car keys. They'll look cute while they bat them around on the table for a while, but have no real concept of their real purpose and how they should be used."
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Dan-O
The Gates of Troy


Joined: 17 Jan 2005
Posts: 1636

PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see you all have been paying attention. My work here is done.
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Bob Bergen
CM


Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Posts: 937

PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Philip Banks wrote:
I see the logic in the above and also see that it is not our job unless we are paid to do the latter. Session fee, use, residuals TVRs et al. In the UK the union Equity is not talking about this. Is it a discussion within SAG-AFTRA?.


Absolutely not, nor should there be. The union demands only minimum wage, benefits, and protections.

Unless it is a broadcast talkshow, which the union demands a scale payment for appearing, celebrities have in their contracts demands from the studios and (or) networks that they will spend time promoting. Often they will spend days/hours in a satellite studio doing press every hour on the hour. I've done it and it is tedious. They are not compensated anything more than what is stipulated in their contract. I have many a friend who, because this was their first big break, did not demand anything more than scale when hired. Many top celebs, those who demand in the millions, understand that their star power can only bring more recognition from the public. Knowing they are only as hirable as their previous gig, they are happy to accommodate. A successful product brings more demand on the next gig. And some, the 20 million stars, may balk on doing any PR. That is rare.

So it makes perfect sense that a voice actor today be asked to bring the same product recognition online. Followers are today's Nielsen Ratings. The more followers the better the chance more will see you post the link to your commercial and buy the product. Or the promo for that TV show and tune in. A commercial buyer who sees an actor promote the spots they've voiced, without that unnecessary brag, have incentives to hire as they want those same followers to perhaps buy their product. Or game. Or watch their cartoon. Etc. This should not be very hard to understand.

No need for the union to demand further compensation as it is not just a courtesy for the artist to promote, this PR is also great for the actor's career. It brings with it future work. And, as follower numbers grow, the actor can demand more compensation as they bring more value.

And I do agree most do not use social media to their advantage. Most also don't pursue acting to their advantage. On all levels the cream will float to the top.

For the record, I hate doing social media. I'm not terribly good at it. The Television Academy is presenting a panel discussion on how actors can better use social media in early March. I'm sad because although I'm producing this event, I cannot attend as I teach that same night.

Look, I didn't love the time and expense to send out reel to reel demos, but I did it as it was necessary. I hate red carpet events, but I do them as it brings value to an organization, network, or studio. I don't get paid a dime. But-I know for a fact it has gotten me more work!
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 11046
Location: Portgordon, Scotland

PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for the clarity, must've taken you ages to write.

We need to be influencers! As I have said elsewhere a friend of mine who is a successful writer told me that to be considered an influencer a person needs at least 50,000 followers e.g on Twitter. I stand at 800. YAYYYYYY go me!
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Bruce
Boardmeister


Joined: 06 Jun 2005
Posts: 7921
Location: Portland, OR

PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having done close to zero marketing on Twitter in the several years I've belonged, I'm up to 35 followers. I guess I'm a member of what you might call the Itty Bitty Twitteritty.

And with just 118 followers elsewhere I'm thinking I'm not even an Instagram cracker.


B
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Bob Bergen
CM


Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Posts: 937

PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Philip Banks wrote:
Thank you for the clarity, must've taken you ages to write.

We need to be influencers! As I have said elsewhere a friend of mine who is a successful writer told me that to be considered an influencer a person needs at least 50,000 followers e.g on Twitter. I stand at 800. YAYYYYYY go me!


Really took no time to write. Pretty simple stuff.

And I am far from an influencer. Just a participant. 😉
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