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Union Discrimination
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 11046
Location: Portgordon, Scotland

PostPosted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone who has ever tried to get $11 out of a $10 bill gets the logic but still hates it.

When an economic and a demographic time bomb explodes there are casualties everywhere. Whilst I see the argument against where the Union chose to "draw the line" no matter where they drew the line it was going to be wrong for someone.

Bob, the time you've spent on this topic is really appreciated.
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todd ellis
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Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 10481
Location: little egypt

PostPosted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

what philip said --- especially the last line.
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Bob Bergen
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Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Posts: 937

PostPosted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave Waters, I think your read is an important one!! Especially for those of us in the union, and those in the union who thrive in the union. I see both sides because I make it a point to see both sides. I find that most on either side are so in their own bubble they are blind to the other side OR are just so far removed they don't relate or even care. But to truly be a part of the bigger picture one needs to be open to both sides, and at least attempt to relate to and understand the needs of both sides. Not easy!!!!! And, it pisses off both sides when I attempt to explain each side to the other side. At various times each side gets really pissed at me!

I've always thought of myself as a double agent. Or, rather, a textbook moderate. I appreciate how I benefit from the union. But I've also seen how since the commercial strike of 2000 and the changing landscape of technology, what is important for a vo actor around the country, like Dave, is not important to those of us in the major markets. I don't find union membership a burden because it benefits me greatly. But these benefits are due to when I got into the business and how long I've been in it. This is a circumstantial luck, combined with a lot of hard work and perhaps a tint of talent. And, I also had very specific goals. I never just wanted to be a working actor. I wanted specific work that came with a pension and health benefits. I am not college educated and did not come from family money. So I knew if I was going to pursue professional acting, I needed to pursue it professionally, thinking not just about the job of the day but how that job will effect my future with a retirement fund and health benefits. As of right now I am capped out when it comes to my pension. That means that I have work enough where I'm at the max the pension will pay out monthly come retirement. And even though I'm nowhere near retirement age, as I continue to work that work will continue to fund the P&H for my fellow performers. I actually take pride in this and value the business model that I can continue in this process for my fellow performers, and in appreciation for those before me who risked their careers to demand benefits in the first place.

When you are so removed from the other side, it's impossible to relate. Which is why I totally understand Dave being turned off by the idea of his work contributing to funding P&H for his fellow performers. I cannot imagine taking a job just for a session fee that does not come with benefits for myself and my fellow performers. We all relate to what works best for us and because of this generational and technological gap, we don't relate to each other. I don't expect anyone to relate to the concept or even importance of residuals, as many think of those who collect them as the fortunate elite, when actually the majority are middle class.

I try SOOO hard to educate the powers that be at the union about the thriving vo community around the country who don't relate to or desire to be a part of the union. The way you all seek out work, invoice, etc., is as foreign and undesirable to the union actor as contributing to a P&H fund is to Dave. It's complicated.
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Deirdre
Czarina Emeritus


Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 13016
Location: East Jesus, Maine

PostPosted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bob Bergen wrote:
n fact, there's more of a chance to help those effected by this/Deebs' current adjustment in AFTRA qualifications.


I hope it's clear I'm not talking about the $17K qualifying amount.
I agree that the trustees and board and whoever can set the bar as high as they want.

It's the uneven bars I object to.

SAG members qualify at $11.2K.
AFTRA members qualify at $17K.

Based on old contracts.
SAG people have benefits AFTRA people don't.

What would you call that?
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Bruce
Boardmeister


Joined: 06 Jun 2005
Posts: 7921
Location: Portland, OR

PostPosted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm recalling terms like grandfathering and featherbedding... antiquated, but so are many of the brains that rule the place and that wonder why they're losing ground.


B
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Gregory Best
The Gates of Troy


Joined: 04 Aug 2005
Posts: 1853
Location: San Diego area (east of Connie and south and east of Bailey)

PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks to everyone for their contributions to this topic. Especially Bob Bergen who has tried very hard to get the union management to acknowledge those of us in the VO trenches that aren't in one the three biggest markets and don't desire to be. Deebs has fought the tough fight too.

May it will change as those who can't seem to get it retire. Maybe Bob will someday be union president. I hope so.
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Bob Bergen
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Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Posts: 937

PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gregory Best wrote:
Maybe Bob will someday be union president. I hope so.


Thanks for your sweet note, Greg, but never!!! Spent several years on the SAG board, several on the AFTRA board, several on the SAG-AFTRA board. My union service days are over. I've taken my service and passions to The Television Academy. Much more respectful and productive. And much more enjoyable. Plus, too many at the union take issue these days with me and my vo pursuits. And, I can do more on behalf of my fellow vo peeps without having my hands tied by being on the board or higher. And, I still have access to many at the union whom I can turn to on behalf of the vo community, from the staff to many still on the board. But I have no desire to serve at the union again. I find it much more fulfilling being hands on with the vo community.
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Lee Gordon
A Zillion


Joined: 25 Jul 2008
Posts: 6843
Location: West Hartford, CT

PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bob Bergen wrote:
too many at the union take issue these days with me and my vo pursuits.


That speaks volumes.
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