VO-BB - 19 YEARS OLD!

[Roar-duh]

It's a big confidence boost when you audition for one audiobook, and the author extends an offer for two. These will be my first audiobooks, and I chose to keep it simple for my first time around. Both of these are non-fiction, royalty share, 1.0 and 1.5 finished hours according to ACX.

For relatively small projects like this, and since I don't have any other projects going on right now, I'm thinking these might be small and simple enough that I can handle editing myself. Do you guys think that's the case, or should I plan on hiring an editor for these small projects? Thanks!
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John Roorda
http://johnroorda.com

[Bob Bergen]

Hey there, John. Congrats. I myself don't do audio books. For me there's just not enough bang for the buck in relation to the time involved. I never wanted to be an editor, just an actor. To not get paid for the time involved editing, to me, is a crime. Plus, I woukd suck at recording audio books and have no desire to improve. I just don't find the idea of it fun, just tedious. But that's just me.

The problem is, as this industry took off, actors were so desperate for work they accepted this business model and, in essence, conditioned book publishers and authors to demand actors be their own editors. It is what it is.

Since I don't work in this genre, I asked a handful of collegues who work in audio books. Of the dozen or so I talked to, only one hires an editor. But he's a rock star in the business and makes a lot of money per finished hour. He negotiates a plus 10% of his fee to pay his editor, so nothing comes out of pocket. And he said he began this practice from the beginning, establishing his own professional standards. By being willing to say no if the buyers didn't agree on the plus 10%, he demanded the kind of career and business model that allowed for the kind of success he now has. Not sure if you are willing to risk asking for this, but it makes sense to me.

[Scott Pollak]

John, I echo what Bob had to say... to a point. First of all congrats! I've done about 60 audiobooks, and I have never hired an editor. Now you will get as many different answers about this as you will about which microphone is best, whether to record with cans or not, whether you should sit or stand, chocolate or vanilla, and so on. One and a half hours is nothing! It really gets daunting when you start getting into the 20-hour audiobooks. While I do quite a few, I just cannot cost justify hiring out an editor. Other people like Jeffrey use them all the time, and for him that's great. Recently I had three audiobooks in production at one time and was sort of wishing I could have farmed it out to an editor. But starting out like this, I see no reason for you to take on that extra expense, especially considering that I would assume you're not making a ton off of these first two audiobooks. Edit it yourself!

However, I also like the idea of the guy that adds 10% on so he can use an editor. It's a great business model to aspire to if you can get there.
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Scott R. Pollak
Clients include Pandora, NPR Atlanta, Wells Fargo, Cisco, Humana, Publix, UPS, AT&T, HP, Xerox and more.

www.voicebyscott.com

[Roar-duh]

Thanks for confirming my instincts, I think that this will be within my capabilities and I'll edit myself. I completely agree that the editing time does have value, and in this case the value of this project is investing in some credits that'll make it easier for me to get those better paying audiobooks and back up that ask for the extra 10%.
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John Roorda
http://johnroorda.com

[vkuehn]

A couple of additional thoughts on why you DO want to edit these two books. When you edit your own narrations, you are forced to slowly listen to your own "voice product". You will hear things, you will SEE things in your voice you never noticed before, and you will know to clean up those things.

And at some future date when you have become established as a NARRATOR of books, then selecting and directing editors may become prudent for you. Unless you have lived through the editing process, what qualifies me or you to evaluate and manage the editors you may choose to hire in the future.

[Lee Gordon]

They're short books, they're royalty share, and you have the capability to do the editing yourself. As it stands, you are out only your time. If you hire somebody, you will be out your time and some money. I think you have the right idea. This one's a DIY project.
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Lee Gordon, O.A.V.
Voice President of the United States
www.leegordonproductions.com
Twitter: @LeeGordonVoice

[todd ellis]

i agree - i can't bear audio books - i have done a grand total of five - and can't wait to not do another one. but at the stage of the game you are in - i say DIY.
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"i know philip banks": todd ellis
who's/on/1st?

[Jeffrey Kafer]

Always hire an editor. Why?

1) audiobook editing is an art. Chances are, you don't know how to do it since you've never produced one.
2) yes, you'll be in the whole some cash, but if you didn't think this book was going to make at least the $50 it will cost to hire an editor, then why are you doing it?
3) if your answer to #2 is "because I want the experience", then $50 is a small price to pay for that experience.
4) you are an actor, not an editor. Your time is better spent narrating another book and letting someone else do the drudgery of editing.

If you can get the author to pony up some cash for editing, great! If they balk, then you know they aren't nearly as vested in the project as they should be and perhaps don't have much faith that the book will sell. Something to keep in mind.
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Jeff
http://JeffreyKafer.com
Voice-overload Web comic: http://voice-overload.com

[vkuehn]

Jeffrey, there are some people that I just never, never, never want to get into an argument with! And you may be at the top of my list.

But let me offer you a couple of alternative thoughts that might have a legitimate place in this conversation.

Maybe the original poster, as a total beginner, doesn't know whether he really wants to be a narrator, or whether he should eventually become an editor. I don't know if I would be comfortable with an editor who had never narrated.

Some of us who are new to book narrating DO have editing experience. As an avocation I have been editing house-of-worship sermons and lectures for years. I have been recording community events and political events for years and editing them. If I want to be a good editor of audio books, I need to learn the peculiar needs of "actors reading books". (Some ministers are excellent voice actors! And some.... not so much. )

I'm guessing that I am at the other end of the age spectrum from the original poster. In considering how much time and energy, how much nuts-bolts-and-hardware to invest in narration, reality tells me that not too far over the horizon there could be looming a day when my voice turns into the kind of crap that I hear in conversations when I attend class reunions and talk to relatives on the phone. I see EDITING as a possible alternate route for me if the voice deteriorates... and yet my enthusiasm for the art continues.

Yes, I have great hopes that my narration skills will be honed... and then recognized... to the point I can be a narrator-only who contracts all editing out to others, but I keep a copy of 'Plan B' in my shirt pocket.

[Jeffrey Kafer]

That's all well and good, if a bit tangential. But one does not "learn" how to edit on what is suppose to be a professional, retail product that customers will plunk real money down on.
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Jeff
http://JeffreyKafer.com
Voice-overload Web comic: http://voice-overload.com

[Philip Banks]

We are hired by people because they believe we are able to do the job not because we hope to be able to do the job at some point in the future.

[Roar-duh]

It seems I've stirred up a hornet's nest!

Vernon, to answer your question, I know that I'd much rather be a narrator than an editor. But, I also know that having a sharp edge on both sets of skills.

Jeffrey, I completely agree with your assessments about practicing on a retail-ready product. As I work on my first 15 minutes, I'll post an excerpt here as a quick "sanity check" to make sure I'm not missing anything on the editing or mastering front. In the future when I'm fortunate enough to have multiple longer projects stacked up I'll definitely use an editor, but right now I have the time and I want the experience.

Philip, when you're doing your first, everything is in the future. Time for me to stop hoping and start doing!
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John Roorda
http://johnroorda.com

[todd ellis]

i think jeff's comments would seem a lot less fearsome if he changed his avatar. it's really quite intimidating.


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"i know philip banks": todd ellis
who's/on/1st?

[glittlefield]

Something with the mouse ears on would do the trick.
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Greg Littlefield
VO-BB Member #59

[DenaliDave]

I personally edit and master my own audio books with a combination of Twisted Wave and Logic Pro X.

It's already been touched upon, but editing your own work forces you to hear yourself over, and over, and over...

Which isn't so bad -- we're voice people, isn't part of the reason we do this? Let's be honest, we like to hear ourselves talk?

It does, however, force you to scrutinize things like pacing, inflection, pauses, mic technique, ect. When mastering, you also are forced to hear just how "good" your environment sounds and where you need to improve.

I listen to, on average (checking now) somewhere between 100-150 hours of audiobooks a month from various respected narrators. That alone has given me a TON of help. What did that narrator do that I liked? How did that other narrator make that character his own? What "works" and what sounds god-awful.

On top of all of that, I'm a musical person and love all aspects of audio engineering. I've produced my own music in Logic, so mastering mono voice tracks is fairly straight-forward.

I'm the type of person who likes to learn. If there's something I need done, I first try and learn to do it myself. I'm also incredibly hard on myself, and will spend hours and hours picking apart my own projects, hearing things that probably no one else does.

If I can do something myself, why shouldn't I? My website for example, I made that entirely on my own. I didn't pay anyone. My logos, promotional material? All me. Why? Because I wanted to learn how. I learned how to take images and make them into vector images with Inkscape the other day. I learned some CSS code the other day.

We doubt ourselves to much. We limit ourselves and squeeze ourselves into tiny niches because its comfortable. We "assume" that we can't possibly do something that someone else does -- so we pay the other guy to do it for us. No, I refuse to be like that. I can learn and do anything I want if I work hard enough for it.

With today's software and plugins, good monitors and a solid knowledge base of what sells, what doesn't, what YOU are capable of with your voice and equipment...it isn't out of the realm of possibility to edit and master audiobooks yourself to sound great.

You get the added bonus of learning how the process works from the inside. I'm not arrogant enough to think "I'm a voice artist, that other stuff is someone else's job".

My audiobook productions are labors of love. I put a lot of myself into them, as I truly enjoy creating quality content. Have you been on audible and heard how astoundingly bad some of the books are? It's insane. It was after hearing several horrible samples in a row that I nearly threw my headphones down in disgust and decided someone (me) had to step up and contribute. I love audio books -- and that's why I make them.
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"The wise ones fashioned speech with their thought, sifting it as grain is sifted through a sieve." - Buddha
www.alaskamic.com