VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

[Darren Altman]

Hey all,

I'm owed money for jobs I've done at the beginning and middle of December, that's over 2 1/2 months. I've sent emails, invoices and follow-up emails, but companies are dragging their feet no end. What do call an acceptable time to excpect to wait for payment?

The dilema is that as freelance voiceover artists, we depend on building regular clients that will come back to us for repeat business, so I don't want to p1ss them off by nagging and have them not call me again and yet I don't want to be ignored!

I look forward to your responses!
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https://www.darrenaltman.com/
http://twitter.com/darrenaltman

[Lee Gordon]

A regular client who doesn't pay you is not much of an improvement over no client at all.
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Lee Gordon, O.A.V.
Voice President of the United States
www.leegordonproductions.com
Twitter: @LeeGordonVoice

[Bruce]

When you can expect payment can partially depend on how far down the line you are from the responsible party. If a company hired an ad agency and they hired a broadcast producer and they went through an agent and they got the job for you, that puts you four steps away from the original checkbook and each might take their time in paying the next person down the line.

Before the current economic troubles my average time of receipt was about 30 days...some would pay early and some would take up to 60 days and most were right around 30. Today it's pushing 60 days and my biggest regular client is frequently pushing 150 days (oy, the heartburn).

Tips to help keep your cash flow more current:

- Get payment up front with anyone brand new that you don't fully trust to pay you in a timely fashion. I've never lost a job when a prospect has said they want to use my voice and I follow up with PayPal details. The only time I don't do this is with major companies that have a reputation to maintain.

- Make your payment terms "due upon receipt" instead of "net 30" or no terms at all. In theory, your invoice should be placed on the top of the "to be paid" pile.

- If you're invoicing a major corporation try using the payment term "2/10 net 30". What that means is they can take a 2% discount from your invoice if they pay it within 10 days. It makes big financial sense for a company to do this (it would take half a page to explain why) and the smart ones do it. It's also good for those of us who are a little more "hand to mouth".

- I try a gentle reminder on people at 35 days...something like: "I was going through my accounting records and I'm showing we're now at 35 days on invoice #8567 in the amount of £1,000. If you have any questions or need a copy of the invoice, please let me know. Thank you for your help with this." At 55 days maybe something like: "I know it seems like only yesterday, but I'm showing I've got an invoice with you that's coming up on the 60 day past due mark, and I wanted to check and see when payment might be made. I only ask because my cat has been eying my toes lately and licking his chops...I have to wear shoes all the time to dissuade him."

- Humor, as in the above, sometimes works well with certain late clients. Since we're in a service business with no hard goods that we can take back for non-payment, we do have to be nicer (at first), and if you don't have an accounting person to be your enforcer, it's tough to play "good cop/bad cop" all by yourself.

Anyway, best of luck. You're not alone.

B
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VO-BB Member #31 Enlisted June, 2005

I'm not a Zoo, but over the years I've played one on radio/TV. .

[LauraS]

Hi Darren

Not sure if there are differences between the way US and the UK do business but certainly in my experience you should have your terms (usually 30 days net) on your invoice and after that you perfectly entitled to start chasing. 2 1/2 months is not acceptable, although there are a few companies who believe that 3 months is fine, regardless of what you state as your own terms of business.

If emails/calls come to nothing then a simple "don't want to have to do this as you are a valued client etc, but I will have to take legal steps if payment isn't forthcoming within 7 days of this missive" Always add something like "Apologies if payment has already been made".

If you are not already a member of Equity then I recommend you join - save you a fortune. If after 2 weeks you still haven't heard back thenjust give Equity a call and they take care of it for you. Best business investment I made, my Equity membership, saved me a FORTUNE in legal fees.

Legal threats made reluctantly but firmly have always worked for me. And I haven't lost clients through it in the main. Maybe one or two, but sometimes the promise that you mean business is enough to get a disorganised producer off his backside.

Hope that helps
Laura

[SkinnyJohnny]

Hi Darren,
More times than not, when they come back wanting more work done, I say "Sure...By the way, there a some invoices that may have fallen through the cracks and I don't show them as being paid yet. Would you mind checking on those for me?"
I've found that sometimes the person that actually hires me may forget to forward the invoice to the payroll department. I've started sending the invoices directly to payroll on a couple of accounts that this has happened on. No more problems since then.
Good luck!
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John Weeks Voice Overs
www.johnweeksvoiceovers.com

[Darren Altman]

Bruce, Laura and Johnny,

thanks so much for tking the time to reply. Your input is invaluable and I appreciate it. If I'm honest (and call me naive), but I don't have any terms or conditions I send out with an invoice or before I start recording, is that stupid? Is it commonplace to do so?

If you do, can I ask what your terms are? I know they will all differ!

Thanks again. x
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http://twitter.com/darrenaltman

[SkinnyJohnny]

I don't either Darren, but probably should. I've been in the business since the early 80's and never have. I've been burned really bad once and that was from a client I had worked with for 10 years. He tried to expand to quickly and went under. So after all was said and done I received $134 as my share of the $14,000 he owed me. That's life!
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John Weeks Voice Overs
www.johnweeksvoiceovers.com

[Darren Altman]

WOAH, that's incredible. How did it build up to that amount Johnny?
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https://www.darrenaltman.com/
http://twitter.com/darrenaltman

[SkinnyJohnny]

It was ongoing work (weekly) and I didn't realize it had been so long. I gave him the benefit of the doubt and figured he would get back on track. It didn't happen. It was a good lesson learned. I watch my books better these days.
_________________
John Weeks Voice Overs
www.johnweeksvoiceovers.com

[LauraS]

Hi Darren

You're a member of Cybers aren't you? There are some posts about it there. But basically if you just put, underneath the date or address, "Terms: 30 days from date of invoice" or similar that should do it. Perhaps at the bottom add something like "Please note that copyright is not granted on recorded material until payment has been received."

Laura

[todd ellis]

my terms are net 17 - why 17? why not. it's an off number - and sometimes people notice. anyhoo - since these bills are from last year you might try something like this:

dear (deadbeat)
my accountant is on my like a dog on a bone to close out 2009. if you could address the enclosed (attached) invoice(s) asap i would greatly appreciate it.

thanks,
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"i know philip banks": todd ellis
who's/on/1st?

[Darren Altman]

One invoice is now 3 at months (2nd December since the gig). I used the line about my cat meowing and licking his chop at me in my reminder yesterday....

Just a thought, have you guys ever called to chase things up? I have no problem in picking up the phone and asking for their accounts department!
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https://www.darrenaltman.com/
http://twitter.com/darrenaltman

[SkinnyJohnny]

I've done that without a problem. I heard that it used to be common for ad agencies to pay 90 days out. They did it with the media and the talent. They would float the money. They would get paid by the client for all the ad buys (big bucks) and talent fees, then put it in a 3 month CD and wait to pay everybody after the CD matured. They would make a good bit of cash on the interest earned.
I don't know if it was standard practice everywhere, but was where I was at the time. CDs paid really good back then. (1980s).
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John Weeks Voice Overs
www.johnweeksvoiceovers.com

[Philip Banks]

Since January 2007 I stopped sending invoices I now send suggestions.