VO-BB - 19 YEARS OLD!

[DaveHines]

Hey Jeff...I'm just a quick drive across I-70. I can come over there and rough 'em up if you want. I'll just come over to KC & start quoting lines from Pulp Fiction & before you know it, they'll be begging to give you the money. Of course, you'll have to return the favor some day here in STL.



"What does Jeff LOOK LIKE?"

[JeffK]

Sounds like a good plan however, I will have to drive your way and pick you up. Together we can go to NY (that's where the "target" is).

[Bruce]

They selected your voice. They knew what you sounded like before they hired you. The only right they have is to have you re-do all or part of the job IF you made errors or delivered it in a style contrary to what they heard in the demo, or to their instructions. They shouldn't, I dare say can't, reduce your pay because they wanted a different voice after they selected you and AFTER you recorded the material.

And this bullshit about they want to apply some of your money to pay for another voice talent is outrageous. This isn't their only project. They make profit on all of their other projects, and if this was a tightly budgeted job, too bad. Some of that other profit may have to go into paying for this poorly made decision of theirs, but not your money.

While you may lose work from this middleman for standing your ground, is he a middleman you want to work with if he doesn't stand up for you once you've explained how wrong this is?

Bruce
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VO-BB Member #31 Enlisted June, 2005

I'm not a Zoo, but over the years I've played one on radio/TV. .

[BenWils]

We should have a "Beware of Jerk" section on this board or something like it so we can all help each other out with info on bad clients and what they did.....what do you think DB? Networks equal power.....
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Ben


"To be really good at voiceover, you need to improve your footwork and hip snap."

[Deirdre]

We have been around the horn here at VO-BB several times with this subject --contemplating the notion of a Bad Guys Page. It comes up a couple times a year, it seems.

My lawyer-acquaintences have adamantly advised me against anything of the sort. I will not allow the posting of anything along the lines of :
"Don't work for Acme Productions, they take 120 days to pay!"
"The guys at Joe Blow Imaging are assholes! I hope no one here ever crosses an electron with those jerks!"

Every once in a while one or the other of us here is moved to post an "Ain't it a shame" message, such as
"I really like the producers at VideoWorks in Reading, PA! They're always so appreciative and the copy is nearly always excellent. It's a darned shame their accounts payable people are so careless-- now I have to ask for full payment up front. It really is a just a dreadful shame."
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DBCooperVO.com

[BenWils]

Ahh yes, probably wise.
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Ben


"To be really good at voiceover, you need to improve your footwork and hip snap."

[Christopher French]

Jeff,

I may be a noob at this wonderful thing we call VO, but I'd say to them "Gimme my 500 bucks, pally! Is it my fault you suddenly decided you wanted a different read from a different person? Services were rendered, payment was agreed upon. I take cash or check. Thank you very much."

Chris
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Christopher G. French

"The only limitations we truly have are the ones we place on ourselves." -Attributed to Donald Trump

[JeffK]

Well after discussions they have come back with $350 which is still well short of the agreed upon amount. Does anyone use some type of a contract prior to providing services or does email correspondence serve as a contract for offer and acceptance?

[Deirdre]

I have a fairly standard boilerplace contract I use with new clients that spells out usage and fees. Most of the time with net-based stuff it's an electronic handshake via e-mail. For broadcast, I'm usually keener on gertting the usage in "writing" even if it is just an e-mail note.

This after-the-fact "bargaining" that is going on is beneath contempt.
Your relationship with your "middle man" is the key element here-- if you want to accept the bitched-down amount the end client offered, tell your ProdCo Pals you're doing it as a favor to THEM, but this particular end client has to cough up cash in advance from here on in--if they even only want a spec spot from you.
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DBCooperVO.com

[anthonyVO]

I always intend to do business with people that I don't need to have a contract with. Remember, a contract is only a piece of paper and its worth depends on the amount you're willing to spend on litigation. It's worked for me thus far.

In the meantime, should you accept the offer, do what db says while clearly explaing your terms going forward and making your middle man aware of the favor you're doing them this first time around. This is a very disrespectful move on their part.

-Anthony

[Apageloman]

Anthony you're right on it.
Deebs I like your approach too, I suspect that legally there is little to be done without an agreed upon signed contract, that stated, I'm not sure that if the preservation of the middle man relationship is a high priority, that I would quickly tell them and the end client cough up the benjamins and then take a hike. While I agree with Bruce that this is entirely bogus disrepectful B.S., there is no call for Jeff to stoop to their level of vitriolic chicanery. The issue here Jeff is less with the end client than it is with your middle man. Going forward, it will be critical to be very clear what your expectations are for them as your representative/advocate with their clients on your behalf.

[Travis]

Dear Mr. Doofus*

On May 23* 2006, you contacted me regarding a voice-over for a client. In your email, you explained that your client, ZaGreedy Corp*, had chosen my voice to narrate their video production. From what I understand, they had listened to my demo, and determined that they preferred my more youthful, energetic, sound to the older-sounding gentleman who had narrated their previous projects. We agreed on a price of $500.00 for the narration track. You informed me that I would be billing your client directly.

In order to provide your client with the best product possible, I recorded that track at a respected, professional recording studio at significant expense to myself, and delivered the voice-over track on June 2nd* 2006.

On June 11, 2006*, you emailed me, to let me know that your client had changed his mind – after hearing my voice-over, they came to the conclusion that they preferred the sound of the older, less energetic narrator. You also indicated that your client was unwilling to pay for their mistake in choosing the wrong narrator.

I’m sure I don’t need to remind you that as a voice-artist, I’m not providing a product, but rather, a service. You understand that unlike a product, your client can’t simply return my voice-over – I can’t put it back up on the shelf and re-sell the voice-over to someone else, like some sort of merchandise returned because it’s the wrong color. Neither you or your client provided any indication at any time that I was providing my voice-over narration on spec or on an “as approved” basis. I’m sure you understand that, under those conditions, a voice-over professional would need to charge considerably more for their services.

I understand that the video production business can be difficult, and that clients can be unreasonable and overly demanding at times. I hope you understand, however, that I had no control over this situation. You and your client asked me to put in my time and effort, I delivered, and then your client determined that they had made a decision they were unhappy with, they expected somebody else (me) to pay for it. I’m sure you understand how that is an unrealistic, unreasonable expectation.

Thank you.

Your Announcer.
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Travis
www.VOTalent.com

[JeffK]

I appreciate everyone’s comments! You guys are great! No wonder I'm addicted to this place. My first reaction when receiving the clients email was anger then doubt, ready to fold and accept whatever table scraps were left but now I am resolved to continue the fight.

Travis, this was excellent, very well written letter. I would like to plagiarize, if you don't mind and send to the client. I will also keep handy in the event this ever happens again.

Thanks again!!!

[Travis]

Hi Jeff.

[JeffK]

Thanks again everyone for your feedback. After careful consideration and with further discussions with the client I am accepting the $350.

DB, your comments make sense and I appreciate them greatly!